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Post by lyn on Jul 25, 2015 6:45:41 GMT
Good idea Ann but it's not possible because Etsy have changed my pricing and I can't alter it.
When I set up the bundle of pdfs for sale in my Etsy shop, I listed it as "£19.99". Etsy has changed my listing that EU customers see (and I cannot alter it) to say "£23.99 vat included".
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Post by zed on Jul 25, 2015 10:48:45 GMT
Thanks for that Ann, it's good to know.
Yeah, all yours have VAT added for me too, Lyn. It'd be good to know what others see, whether the VAT is adjusted for their own country
I saw you direct buyers to your site Lyn, I'm going to see if I have enough hosting space on e-junkie to add my others.
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Post by lyn on Jul 25, 2015 17:05:43 GMT
Yup - I'm prolly breaking a raft of Etsy rules there Zed by directing to our site. But stuff 'em.
Right Zed - get your thinking gear around this one.
Apparently Etsy is responsible for collecting vat and therefore Etsy is technically the seller, so the fact that I am in the UK is neither here nor there.
Righto.
If that's the case and I am not the seller but Etsy is, then why do I get the money direct for the sale of goods with the vat. If Etsy is the seller then Etsy should get the money and vat then give me what's left over after fees etc.
I always thought that I was the seller and that I hired (by paying fees) a shop window space from Etsy?
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Post by zed on Jul 25, 2015 22:14:52 GMT
It's ridiculous, isn't it? I actually agree with what they originally said, they are basically a venue, no different to a shopping centre or market hall, and we are the small businesses renting premises. I understand people don't want the hassle of doing the VAT themselves, but there are sites which are doing it properly, like you said, collecting the added VAT at point of sale. I got a reply from the woman 'Etsy is considered to be responsible for collecting VAT, so the UK threshold exempting some sellers from registering for VAT does not apply. As a result, UK buyers are required to pay VAT on applicable digital items purchased from shops based in the UK. Regarding your concerns about US customers seeing prices plus VAT, please contact our Support team so one of our Member Advisors can get more specific information from you. Thanks for sharing your concerns! Please go to this page to contact Support: www.etsy.com/help/contact' I double checked, and it hasn't changed UK to UK sales are exempt unless the business is VAT registered. They haven't answered the business to business question either.
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Post by jwugg on Jul 26, 2015 5:58:53 GMT
Lyn, Here in Greece, your bundle shows as E29.05 today, which is the equivalent of £20.50, so no VAT showing.
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Post by lyn on Jul 26, 2015 10:55:47 GMT
Thank you Jill. Greece is definitely in the EU so that's a mystery. I just checked Etsy (my viewpoint is set at UK) and the bundle is still showing as "£23.99". If I open the listing to view the detail (as a potential customer would) it shows "£23.99 vat included".
I think it's time to stop banging my head on the wall (it hurts) and choose my battles wisely. Maybe this is one battle I need to walk away from?
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Post by zed on Jul 26, 2015 11:07:45 GMT
I don't understand why they have one half wit American answering all the questions, or avoiding the questions, I should say.
People who are VATMoss registered want to know how they can opt out or have proof-no response People want to know why they are paying fees on VAT etsy forwards to them, before taking it off them-no response They still think UK buyers have to pay VAT from UK sellers.
What are you thinking of doing, Lyn, leaving etsy, or leaving it as it is and hoping UKers buy from your site?
I probably have 1 UK and 1 EU buyer a year, but I don't want anyone getting fleeced and it was showing VAT to US customers too.
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Post by lyn on Jul 26, 2015 11:41:35 GMT
Zed, I'm thinking of staying on Etsy and just hoping that UK customers see my notices before they click the button. Presently we can legally work around the vat in europe by physically sending the pdfs attached to emails. However, and I'm sorry to spoil your Sunday roast, we have a new wave of rules coming... NEW RULES
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Post by lyn on Jul 26, 2015 11:48:19 GMT
Woo-hoo - apprently there is a huge demand (and possibility) of a threshold to be in place! So my letter to parliament wasn't a waste of ink then? THRESHOLD
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Post by zed on Jul 26, 2015 13:03:41 GMT
I knew they were planning to add the VAT onto everything, but I do hope we get a threshold, it is just unworkable.
I wonder if etsy charging VAT to UKers is some kind of tax fraud? I wonder too how much profit they'll make collecting little sums of money and holding it while it gains interest until they have to pay it.
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Post by lyn on Jul 26, 2015 14:06:40 GMT
No Zed, Etsy are collecting vat correctly because Etsy has taken on the role of seller, so the whole of europe is treated the same.
I hope we get a threshold too - it's the only sane way forward.
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Post by zed on Jul 27, 2015 10:46:01 GMT
I saw them say something similar, they are not in the UK so can charge UK buyers. I still don't think it's fair. They're a collecting agent, not the seller.
Even if we do get a threshold it won't make any difference if etsy are regarded as 'the seller', unless the threshold is EU wide, but then etsy are above the threshold, so it still won't make any difference.
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Post by lyn on Jul 27, 2015 11:36:40 GMT
Doh! I hadn't thought of that Zed!
But at least a threshold would let us off the hook when selling from our websites to europe.
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Post by zed on Jul 27, 2015 12:06:49 GMT
Maybe we should mention it to etsy that it is going to be easier for a lot of us to sell from our own sites, maybe if there's no incentive for people to stay at etsy, they'll pull their finger out and create one by giving us options.
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Post by lyn on Jul 27, 2015 14:30:16 GMT
I'd like to think so but there are too many people without their own sites for Etsy to worry about those who do.
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